Wednesday, June 13, 2007
The Answer Key
Ok. Now that you’ve taken the test from the last post, I’ll now provide the answer key. I consulted numerous experts from around the world and I’ve boiled down their collective advice into a succinct set of answers.
But first, let’s talk about that asinine ending on the very last episode of the Sopranos.
I’ve read some critics describe the ending as “genius”, “classic Sopranos genre”, etc… You know what I say? Bull S***! The ending was a gimmick. It was an insult. I’ve spent the last 6 years dedicated to watching this show. 85 episodes in all. Faithfully – every Sunday night. I’ve dedicated myself not only to this show but also to it’s creator David Chase.
He owes me. He owes me - big time. Then, when it’s finally time for him to deliver, he pulls this crap. In case you did catch it, the show concludes with about 10 minutes of ‘set-up’ with Tony meeting his entire family for dinner in a Coney Island type restaurant. The tension builds. A suspicious looking guy walks across the floor past Tony and towards the bathroom. The obvious conclusion is that this guy is a hit man who will soon put a gun to Tony’s temple and pull the trigger.
But before the story can complete, the TV screen goes completely black and silent for a full 8 seconds. I thought my cable went out. Then, the credits start to roll. So instead of ending the show, instead of trying to come up with an ending, instead of “maning up”, this guy, David Chase, cops out. He shrinks. He throws in the towel. He just gives up. What a wimp! I’m pissed…I’ll get over it.
Now, back to the answer key:
Question #1.
I’m in the big blind with 9-2o. An EP player raises to $10. Seven players call. Do I
a) Fold
b) Call – getting 7:1 odds. This is an easy call.
c) Raise – the original raiser is the only one who has shown strength.
The Answer
This is a pretty easy answer. Fold - $10 is real money – don’t waste it. You are out of position the entire hand. Even if you flop a monster (i.e., 9-9-7), when you’re up against 7 other players, the risk of getting complete stacked by someone holding A-9 or 7-7 is too great. You’ll do yourself a favor and avoiding situations like this where you are at risk of making mistakes.
Question #2
At a 9 handed table. Seat 1 has $500. He’s a bad but experienced player – a real donkey. Seat #2 has about $50. He’s mediocre, but you can tell he’s looking to get his money all in at any moment. This guy is just looking for a spot to gamble. My friend, BS, is seat #8 and first to act he has about $425 and is holding Ac-10c. He leads out for $10 which is standard and is called by Donkey and Gambler. The flop comes Ax-Qc-3c.
Should BS
A) Check with the intention of raising 3x the opener’s bet. Then, call any 2x or 3x reraise – fold to a larger raise
B) Lead out for a 2/3rds pot sized bet – call any 2x or 3x reraise - fold to a larger raise
C) check - call any normal bet
D) check - fold any normal bet
The Answer
BS really has no idea where he stands right now. This table is pretty loose. These players could be playing any top 50% hands. Being first to act is a huge disadvantage. BS should treat his hand as “drawing-plus.” BS should lead out for a bet of about 2/3rds the pot and consider this primarily a semi-bluff. This gives him control of the betting and may just win the pot right there or at least win him free cards.
A small re-raise (2x-3x) of BS’s semi-bluff tends to “price him in” to see the turn. For example, if BS leads out for $20 and is reraised to $50, he’d need to call $30 into a pot of $104 (3.5:1). Being a 4:1 dog to hit a club on the turn, BS would need to make, via implied odds, merely another $20 to make this call break even. If BS hits a club on the turn, he’ll make value bets on both the turn and the river well in excess of $20. There is not much value in making a large All-in reraise back at the Donkey. This type of player is not really capable of laying down any decent made hand (A-K, A-Q, or A-J).
Conversely, if Donkey makes a large re-raise of BS’s opening $20 bet (5x or more), it destroys the semi-bluff and BS should fold – having avoided putting himself in a position where he’d “have to” call off his entire stack.
But first, let’s talk about that asinine ending on the very last episode of the Sopranos.
I’ve read some critics describe the ending as “genius”, “classic Sopranos genre”, etc… You know what I say? Bull S***! The ending was a gimmick. It was an insult. I’ve spent the last 6 years dedicated to watching this show. 85 episodes in all. Faithfully – every Sunday night. I’ve dedicated myself not only to this show but also to it’s creator David Chase.
He owes me. He owes me - big time. Then, when it’s finally time for him to deliver, he pulls this crap. In case you did catch it, the show concludes with about 10 minutes of ‘set-up’ with Tony meeting his entire family for dinner in a Coney Island type restaurant. The tension builds. A suspicious looking guy walks across the floor past Tony and towards the bathroom. The obvious conclusion is that this guy is a hit man who will soon put a gun to Tony’s temple and pull the trigger.
But before the story can complete, the TV screen goes completely black and silent for a full 8 seconds. I thought my cable went out. Then, the credits start to roll. So instead of ending the show, instead of trying to come up with an ending, instead of “maning up”, this guy, David Chase, cops out. He shrinks. He throws in the towel. He just gives up. What a wimp! I’m pissed…I’ll get over it.
Now, back to the answer key:
Question #1.
I’m in the big blind with 9-2o. An EP player raises to $10. Seven players call. Do I
a) Fold
b) Call – getting 7:1 odds. This is an easy call.
c) Raise – the original raiser is the only one who has shown strength.
The Answer
This is a pretty easy answer. Fold - $10 is real money – don’t waste it. You are out of position the entire hand. Even if you flop a monster (i.e., 9-9-7), when you’re up against 7 other players, the risk of getting complete stacked by someone holding A-9 or 7-7 is too great. You’ll do yourself a favor and avoiding situations like this where you are at risk of making mistakes.
Question #2
At a 9 handed table. Seat 1 has $500. He’s a bad but experienced player – a real donkey. Seat #2 has about $50. He’s mediocre, but you can tell he’s looking to get his money all in at any moment. This guy is just looking for a spot to gamble. My friend, BS, is seat #8 and first to act he has about $425 and is holding Ac-10c. He leads out for $10 which is standard and is called by Donkey and Gambler. The flop comes Ax-Qc-3c.
Should BS
A) Check with the intention of raising 3x the opener’s bet. Then, call any 2x or 3x reraise – fold to a larger raise
B) Lead out for a 2/3rds pot sized bet – call any 2x or 3x reraise - fold to a larger raise
C) check - call any normal bet
D) check - fold any normal bet
The Answer
BS really has no idea where he stands right now. This table is pretty loose. These players could be playing any top 50% hands. Being first to act is a huge disadvantage. BS should treat his hand as “drawing-plus.” BS should lead out for a bet of about 2/3rds the pot and consider this primarily a semi-bluff. This gives him control of the betting and may just win the pot right there or at least win him free cards.
A small re-raise (2x-3x) of BS’s semi-bluff tends to “price him in” to see the turn. For example, if BS leads out for $20 and is reraised to $50, he’d need to call $30 into a pot of $104 (3.5:1). Being a 4:1 dog to hit a club on the turn, BS would need to make, via implied odds, merely another $20 to make this call break even. If BS hits a club on the turn, he’ll make value bets on both the turn and the river well in excess of $20. There is not much value in making a large All-in reraise back at the Donkey. This type of player is not really capable of laying down any decent made hand (A-K, A-Q, or A-J).
Conversely, if Donkey makes a large re-raise of BS’s opening $20 bet (5x or more), it destroys the semi-bluff and BS should fold – having avoided putting himself in a position where he’d “have to” call off his entire stack.
Comments:
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Back from Vegas now (a little poorer), but it was good experience. I played a lot of cash (sometimes at tight tables, sometimes at extremely aggressive tables). While I believe there are good strategies involved in playing a hand that will give you the best odds, I definitely feel nobody has the "right" way of playing.
the question of calling verus re-raising all depends on the situation. Sometimes calling can look more threatening than re-raising. One of the only plays that I played well was against a woman who I only know to bet with top pair. I called her pre-flop raise with 9-10. On my gutshot I called on the flop, and called her bet on the turn. On the river I re-raised all in (basically knowing she only played with top pair and bet that way). She folded and had said "You made your straight, good job" -- then I showed her the bluff. In that case I was making plays based on the situation, as I definitely was not making calls for the "pot odds". Unfortunately, I couldn't keep that same level of play all night.
I may have been lucky she also didn't make a straight on me, LOL.
the question of calling verus re-raising all depends on the situation. Sometimes calling can look more threatening than re-raising. One of the only plays that I played well was against a woman who I only know to bet with top pair. I called her pre-flop raise with 9-10. On my gutshot I called on the flop, and called her bet on the turn. On the river I re-raised all in (basically knowing she only played with top pair and bet that way). She folded and had said "You made your straight, good job" -- then I showed her the bluff. In that case I was making plays based on the situation, as I definitely was not making calls for the "pot odds". Unfortunately, I couldn't keep that same level of play all night.
I may have been lucky she also didn't make a straight on me, LOL.
how were the choices
a) check/call
b) check/raisesmall
c) check/raiseAllin
and the answer is "bet/call only if you have immediate odds" ???????
a) check/call
b) check/raisesmall
c) check/raiseAllin
and the answer is "bet/call only if you have immediate odds" ???????
sopranos -
Eh, it wasn't that bad. Phil got whacked. Tony's family is all alive but miserable in their lifestyle (as they should be).
Also, some people on the internet think you can intepret the 8 seconds of black as "tony got shot in the back of the head and is dead" if you really want.
I was pretty sure something was wrong when i watched it, but the episode before was awesome enough that I dont feel too bad
Eh, it wasn't that bad. Phil got whacked. Tony's family is all alive but miserable in their lifestyle (as they should be).
Also, some people on the internet think you can intepret the 8 seconds of black as "tony got shot in the back of the head and is dead" if you really want.
I was pretty sure something was wrong when i watched it, but the episode before was awesome enough that I dont feel too bad
Come on Johnny Boy...where's your sense of imagination and creativity. You should use what you have and turn OnStar around.
Anyway, I thought the ending was not great, but wasn't that bad. You knew they would leave it open for interpretation -- Some thinking he is dead and others thinking he is just fine. No worries there.
Movie in 2010? Perhaps...Perhaps...Perhaps
Anyway, I thought the ending was not great, but wasn't that bad. You knew they would leave it open for interpretation -- Some thinking he is dead and others thinking he is just fine. No worries there.
Movie in 2010? Perhaps...Perhaps...Perhaps
# posted by 
: 6:40 PM
: 6:40 PM
Of course, you are correct. There is no one precise way to play a hand in all situations. But, there is a generally correct way to play a hand that works best in most situations. I had the advantage of being at the table, so I had a lot of "insider" info.
The answer - according to experts from around the world - on the question about top pair with a flush draw is to lead out with a bet and if re-raised, call if you are getting the right odds to call to see one card (the turn) - being certain to not over-estimate implied odds here as any donkey can see a flush board and might not call off a hugh portion of thier stack when staring at a flush board.
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The answer - according to experts from around the world - on the question about top pair with a flush draw is to lead out with a bet and if re-raised, call if you are getting the right odds to call to see one card (the turn) - being certain to not over-estimate implied odds here as any donkey can see a flush board and might not call off a hugh portion of thier stack when staring at a flush board.
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